Although I’m not a mom (or even a woman for that matter), I thought that I’d start a discussion thread on here about circumcision of boys (hope that I’m allowed to post here). As you could probably infer, I’m male and thankfully I was left intact (I will be using that term rather than “uncircumcised”) despite being born in the U.S. in the 1980s, and if I have any sons I will ask that they be left that way. In general I am strongly against circumcision without legitimate medical reasons on a non-consenting person (I’ll remain silent on religious circumcision). Here’s a good site that expresses how I feel on the issue (warning: pictures of penises there for educational purposes): http://www.circumstitions.com
ETA: In light of the recent ([name]April[/name] 14, 2011) debate about this thread, I removed what originally made the idea for this thread come about (a unisex name debate and how from my personal experience there seemed to be a correlation between opinions on the unisex-names-for-boys and the circumcision issue, but I removed it since I didn’t want to further elaborate on that for any newbies who saw this thread for the first time since it was brought back up).
I googled this subject and it appears that the prevailing attitude by the medical community re circumcision today is that they are not in favour of it.
I got my son circumsized, and while there weren’t any complications I instantly wished we hadn’t done it. They did it at the hospital the day he was born and when they brought him back I could tell he was in pain. He seemed to be fine very shortly after, but still. It was just terrible to see him in pain and not be able to do anything about it when he was so small, especially knowing that it wasn’t necessary.
The gallery of famous intact men on that site is interesting, it’s tons of people! ([name]Ewan[/name] [name]McGregor[/name] … A lot of the stuff there is interesting, actually. I don’t get why circumsition became so common in the first place.
I think one reason it’s still so popular is because people want their sons to “match” their dads. I wonder now if that even matters at all. I mean, they match well enough, don’t they? I mean I don’t think kids would get all confused because they have foreskin and their dad doesn’t. Or would that be a problem? I really don’t know, just speculating.
Anyway, if I ever have another son I probably won’t have him circumsized. The pain of the procedure is too much for me to make a child endure again. I don’t think I’ll look at that site anymore, though, makes me sad.
Great post, [name]Lyndsay[/name]! I forgive you for circumcising your first son, since it appears that you did not know the full truth about the procedure then (and you said you won’t circumcise any future ones).
Luckily for me my mom learned how painful circumcision was before I was born. When she was in the hospital when her first child (who was a girl) was born, she heard a baby screaming extremely loudly and asked what was going on. The doctor said that the baby was being circumcised. At that point, she decided that any future sons of hers would not be cut. My dad was circumcised, and not having “matching” penises was never a problem (other than me asking when I was younger why mine had the skin that his didn’t).
Yes, that site contains a lot of information on circumcision and other types of nonconsensual genital altering, and after looking around on there it makes you think about what circumcision is really all about (like they say on there foreskin is “not just a flap of skin”).
ETA: On why circumcision became so popular (besides in religious circles), the idea started in the late 19th century to help reduce masturbation (we know that didn’t work). After that they’ve kept coming up with new “benefits” of circumcision to keep it going (the most recent being that it helps prevent AIDS and other STDs, which anyone who has been educated on sex knows is not true).
Thanks for the forgiveness, [name]Kelly[/name]! I wonder how they thought it would reduce masturbation? They came up with crazy stuff back in the day. Did you know graham crackers were invented by a Reverend to reduce “carnal urges”? Corn Flakes, too. They thought eating bland foods would do the trick. Haha.
I really wonder why they still push it at the hospital. Why not just stop?
I’m glad to hear that not matching your dad wasn’t a big deal. [name]Do[/name] you think it would be an issue between two brothers?
I know I may get yelled at but I think it should be the choice of the mom. It doesn’t have to be painful either. We waited till my son was almost a month old and he didn’t even cry. It was never pushed on me and I wouldn’t push it on anyone else but I do plan to have any future sons circumcised too.
I think a good explanation in this case would be similar to the circumcised father/intact son one (except that you made the decision in both cases rather than society in general with the father/son one); mention that circumcision was once thought to be better but you learned the truth and are now against it. Since you now know better please definitely leave any future son(s) intact!
I never thought much about circumcision until I was pregnant with my son. My wonderful midwife informed provided me with lots of information on the practice so I could make an informed decision. My husband (who is cut) and I agreed we could never do that to our son. If he wants to be cut when he is older (though I don’t know why he would), it can be his choice. It is his body and even though I am his mother, I won’t make that choice for him. Female circumcision is common practice in some countries yet in the US it is consider genital mutilation. I don’t know why our sons don’t get the same respect.
I’m curious why it should be the mother’s choice over the fathers. I mean if you were leaving it up to one parent, I’d think the father should have more of a say on this subject.
I’m curious why it should be the mother’s choice over the fathers. I mean if you were leaving it up to one parent, I’d think the father should have more of a say on this subject.[/quote]
Or better yet let the CHILD have the most say (i.e. leave it the way it is until he can decide for himself). An instance where I think the mother’s opinion should override the father’s is if the latter insists on circumcision for “matching” or other trivial reasons.
Interesting and educational thread!! My husband is intact due to his father being hung over and missing the appointment. I prefer it that way, haha, and if we have any sons I’d wish to leave them intact but my husband doesn’t feel the same. Some of his reasons are:
Girls…He was always very self concious when he was with girls the first times.
[name]Locker[/name] Rooms…same as above…haha, well kind of. [name]Just[/name] not being the same and getting teased.
Painful…When he was young it was very painful to peel the skin back to clean. (to me this is a tiny bit of justice for our periods and growing breasts…ouch!!)
I hope I can talk him out of it when/if the time comes but I feel it should be up to him in the end.
Though I’m not entirely sure why it came up on a naming site…I think part of the reason new parents are still circumcising is because its what their parents. My husband was circumcised when he was a baby…why? Because his grandma hadn’t circumcised his uncle and then when he joined the army (or something like that), they made him get circumcised.
For reasons #1 and #2, point out to him that the circumcision rate is dropping (last I heard the nationwide average across the U.S. is somewhere between 50-60%, so being intact is no longer being the “oddball” one in many areas). Similar to what I said about the unisex name issue, it will probably be different for your son’s generation than your husband’s.
For reason #3, “peeling” the foreskin back (also known as retracting) before it’s ready to go back on its own is improper care (if you look around at the website whose URL is in the OP of this thread you’ll find the section on proper care of an intact penis). There is no need to “clean” under a foreskin that hasn’t become retractable on its own yet. The first one to retract his foreskin should be the boy himself (the average age of retractability is around 10 years old or so, but can range anywhere from being retractable at birth to late teenage years). If when he is ready for sexual intercourse it isn’t retractable, there are ways to help enable it to do so (but should not be attempted before it’s ready anytime before that). There is a lot of misinformation on the proper care of the intact penis, much of which came about during the era when upwards of 80% of American boys were circumcised and the correct intact care was forgotten. In fact, a circumcised penis actually requires more care during the time that it is healing (and possibly for much longer if complications occur).
ETA: Below is the URL to the specific page on the aforementioned site about the proper care for an intact penis (Warning: a nude intact male image is at the top of the page).
ETA2: If your DH wishes he was cut, why doesn’t he go get circumcised himself? Contrary to what you or he may think adult circumcision is actually in many ways less traumatic than when done as a infant since in most cases the foreskin has already naturally separated, plus he can say if he’s experiencing pain and be given pain relief (that may not be safe to give to a newborn baby). If he doesn’t want to get it done to himself he shouldn’t have it done on someone who can’t give consent.
While I see your point, I’d also like to point out that nature doesn’t “design,” we were blindly created by evolution and natural selection. And there are many things that we have that are unnecessary. Like the tailbone and appendix and wisdom teeth. We still get wisdom teeth removed because they are unnecessary. Humans have vestigial structures, and we haven’t yet evolved out of having these unneeded structures.
Anyway, I was raised in a Jewish family so my little brother was circumcised. My mom said it was so hard for her to watch and that I was worried about my baby brother, seeing him in pain.
When the time comes that I do have kids, many many years down the road, I’ll most likely let my husband make the ultimate decision.
Either way, I can see both sides to this issue. And luckily I won’t have to decide on this for my own kids for years to come.
rachelmarie your comment re nature is another subject altogether one that I do not wish to pursue. I believe that we have all been divinely created - thus my comment.
We did not circumcise our son, but I actually feel guilty about it sometimes. The circumcision rate is very high where we live, and I do worry a little bit about teasing. Most of the little boys we know have been circumcised. I also wonder how we’re going to explain our choice to him without seeming judgmental about parents that did choose circumcision. Because honestly, the AAP is very wish-washy on the subject and it seems that no matter what choice you make, someone will be there to tell you it was the wrong one. I’ve had friends tell me about all the diseases he’s going to get. I usually respond that if we remove any body part at birth”tonsils, breasts, eyelids”yes, you’d be much less likely to get diseases there. In any case, I think most parents try to do what they think is best for their kids. No one wants to see their kids suffer”physically or emotionally.
For the (potential) teasing part, here’s a helpful page (from the same site I mentioned in the OP):
Whatever you do, please don’t circumcise him solely for that reason. If you lived in an area where most of the teenage girls got boob jobs, would you give your daughter one just for that reason? Or any other unnecessary permanent surgical procedure?
by namefan on Wed [name]May[/name] 12, 2010 8:30 am
Although I’m not a mom (or even a woman for that matter), I thought that I’d start a discussion thread on here about circumcision of boys (hope that I’m allowed to post here). As you could probably infer, I’m male and thankfully I was left intact (I will be using that term rather than “uncircumcised”) despite being born in the U.S. in the 1980s, and if I have any sons I will ask that they be left that way. In general I am strongly against circumcision without legitimate medical reasons on a non-consenting person (I’ll remain silent on religious circumcision). Here’s a good site that expresses how I feel on the issue (warning: pictures of penises there for educational purposes): http://www.circumstitions.com
(What brought me to this idea is the thread on the boys’ names forum about [name]Morgan[/name] for a boy; it seems like for me that the same ones that criticize me for wanting to use “unisex” names on boys often also criticize me for wanting to leave boys intact.)
Reply
Circumcision was something that my SO and I discussed a lot during our pregnancy, as both of us have conflicting feelings concerning it. While neither of us was raised to be religious, [name]David[/name] was circumcised as a baby, as were both of our fathers. We spent much of the first trimester researching possible medical repercussions, care if we decided not to cut, etc.
In the end I decided to let him have the final say on the matter. I personally know two men who have had to be circumcised later in life (they were both in their 20’s) because of infection, and didn’t want to be swayed by their traumas or their decisions to circumcise their own sons. I also had a particularly harrowing experience as a nanny to an uncut 3 y.o…I’ll leave out the details but to say that he got too aggressive when exploring his body.
When [name]Kaleb[/name] showed up (MUCH earlier than expected), [name]David[/name] chose to have him circumcised…and I was shocked by the relief I felt. We ended up waiting until he was 7 months old, when he had to have pelvic surgery, so that there would be no additional pain, and haven’t had any regrets about it.
Circumcision is absolutely an important and personal decision for parents that in my mind, shouldn’t be judged, whether it be for religious reasons or other. I would never criticize anybody for their choice as I would hope they wouldn’t criticize me for mine.
… A lot of the stuff there is interesting, actually. I don’t get why circumsition became so common in the first place.