Hot Takes? 🤭

[kasatka]

The names people call “tacky and made-up?” I think some of them are really cute.

[firefly305]

I was with you until “weird Irish names that you cannot pronounce.”

If someone is Irish and they choose to not conform to their colonizer’s language, I see no issue with that personally. Native tongue should not be denigrated simply because it seems odd to the Western world. It’s beautiful that one’s heritage can shine through one’s name, especially if it’s proof that a people have survived their oppressors. Choosing a name that was sculped outside the [name_f]English[/name_f] language can be an act of resistance… or one of the last remaining remnants of a culture that its colonizers almost entirely swept up during their crusades.

[kasatka]

I was thinking this, but didn’t know how to put it into words, thank you!

[itsjustjack]

@firefly305

If someone is Irish and they choose to not conform to their colonizer’s language, I see no issue with that personally.

I strongly agree with this. Though my family is all American born and raised, we’re Irish-American and have strong ties to our very [name_u]South[/name_u] Irish roots. I have had relatives and acquaintances who’ve used Gaelic names (A!vlyn, S3amus, C3dric, A!bhinn, R0is1n) and I see nothing wrong with that. I would happily use the names [name_f]Niamh[/name_f] ([name_f]Neve[/name_f]), [name_f]Aoife[/name_f] (EE-fa), [name_f]Saoirse[/name_f] (SAIR-shuh), [name_f]Aisling[/name_f] (ASH-lin), [name_f]Roisin[/name_f] (ro-SHEEN), [name_f]Fionnuala[/name_f] (fin-oo-luh) or [name_f]Siobhan[/name_f] (shuh-VAWN) on my own daughter, and I wouldn’t use any of the “Americanized” spellings at all (especially not [name_f]Neve[/name_f]). Other people can feel differently and that’s fine, but with all due respect to the original poster of this hot take, calling these names “weird Irish names” is at the very least a little hurtful to families like mine.

[firefly305]

I’m not sure what the poster’s intents were, but attacking traditional Irish names can be code for attacking all names that aren’t phonetic according to the [name_f]English[/name_f] language, so really you’re insulting every colonized nation that still practices its pre-colonized naming style.

[itsjustjack]

Actually, that’s my hot take on this topic. I, personally, do not like the name [name_f]Neve[/name_f], because to me it’s an Americanized spelling like [name_u]Kiva[/name_u] or Saresha that I just can’t get behind. I know it’s a popular name on here and no offense or hard feelings to anyone who likes it, but I find it hard to get past it for myself. I have similar feelings about the name [name_u]Sean[/name_u] spelled any other way, as well as the name [name_f]Ashlyn[/name_f], but that’s a whole different ballgame and we won’t go there.

And @firefly305, very very true. Honestly my biggest wish for the Nameberry community is that we could embrace international names more. I use [name_f]Ireland[/name_f] as an example because 1) it is a colonized nation, one of course of at least dozens if not hundreds 2) it was the original poster’s example and 3) I’m Irish-American so I feel more qualified to speak to this than to nations I have no heritage in, but yes! Your point is so needed.

[firefly305]

Oh, yeah, I had no issue with your response. I was just clarifying that attacking traditional Irish names and calling them weird may seem a “safer” way to reveal one’s prejudice than to directly call out non-white communities, but it’s got the same purpose – encouraging oppressed peoples to march lockstep to their colonizer’s ways.

[Luminen]

I completely agree with you @firefly305 and @itsjustjack. I constantly struggle with this as an adult who voluntarily moved to an [name_f]English[/name_f] speaking country - people trying to Anglicise my Finnish name to make it easier to pronounce and spell (‘can’t you just go by [name_f]Caroline[/name_f]’… no, that’s not my name), and it is exhausting to deal with the complete lack of respect for my identity. Now, I’m an adult who chose to live here and can handle it - I can’t imagine what dealing with this attitude is like for a child growing up. I think it really could damage a child’s self esteem and sense of self, and it really saddens me.

[choupette]

I take issue with the comment about “weird” Irish, Greek and Spanish names. Whatever your intention is, it’s not okay to disparage non-[name_f]English[/name_f] names as a whole.

[lumosmaxima]

I love nicknames of all kinds, if they’re abstracted or family oriented or just there— love them. I will find a name to match the nicknames I like. Literally I will hunt for hours. I love the silly ones and the serious ones, the ones based on meaning or culturally-embedded ones (Madlenka for Marie, et. al.), ones that you have to really dig back in history for (my love Hobby for Rob- names). I think nicknames are the pinnacle of endearing!

I also love “weird” names from other languages, places, cultures. Names are a fascinating window to global learning, and when we can appreciate names, we have the invariable opportunity to then learn how they arose, who the people of the culture are, the languages they speak, what they’ve overcome, where they are in the world, what their cultural practices are…! Maybe not everyone is a culture & history enthusiast, but this world is such a big, beautiful, wild & varied place. I’ve always seen names as a way to learn.

[leafsgirl44]

@anon91011817

Completely arbitrary nicknames (ex. Cordelia nn Cody, Elizabeth nn Elsie, Phillip nn Pippin, Caspian nn Kip)

[name_f]Elsie[/name_f] is derived from [name_f]Elizabeth[/name_f], actually! [name_f]Elsie[/name_f] comes from [name_f]Elspeth[/name_f], which is the Scottish form of [name_f]Elizabeth[/name_f]. (everyone else has covered the Irish, Greek and Spanish names, and I fully agree with them!)

[leafsgirl44]

I love “cheesy” word names - [name_f]Sunday[/name_f], [name_u]Journey[/name_u], [name_f]Miracle[/name_f], [name_f]Promise[/name_f], [name_f]Hope[/name_f], [name_u]Harmony[/name_u], [name_f]Heaven[/name_f], [name_f]Mercy[/name_f], [name_u]Truly[/name_u], [name_f]Serenity[/name_f], [name_u]Genesis[/name_u], [name_f]Heavenly[/name_f], [name_f]Sapphire[/name_f], [name_u]Harvest[/name_u], [name_f]Blessing[/name_f], [name_f]Kaydence[/name_f], [name_f]Jubilee[/name_f], [name_u]Eden[/name_u], [name_f]Faith[/name_f], [name_f]Charity[/name_f], [name_f]Grace[/name_f], [name_f]Hosanna[/name_f], [name_f]Praise[/name_f], [name_f]Liberty[/name_f], [name_u]Lyric[/name_u], [name_u]Sailor[/name_u], [name_f]Delight[/name_f], etc.

Also, I find “too religious” to be a bit of an uncomfortable phrase sometimes, as I feel as though it means I should be ashamed or embarrassed over the fact that my names are “too religious” and that just doesn’t quite sit right with me?

[OpheliaFlora]

I have [name_m]Frederick[/name_m] [name_f]Rose[/name_f] on my list (though at the moment it’s [name_m]Frederick[/name_m] [name_f]Lillie[/name_f]), I think it’s wonderful, especially with first names that have harder sounds.

As for names from different cultures, I say embrace them, embrace your heritage but also expect that people will not spell or pronounce them correctly (perhaps ever). I think it’s a beautiful thought that everyone should care enough to take the time to learn the name, I really wish it were this way, however, from experience (not so much mine but former classmates), don’t expect that to be the case. So for me the question then arises wether I want the name to always be the first thing everyone focuses on or if that is perhaps too much for a child to bear.
Not so much a hot take but my train of thought, without judgement.

[EJpuddlejumper]

@anon91011817

[name_f]Amelia[/name_f]

I do not care for this either because literally every fifth girl who is not [name_f]Olivia[/name_f], [name_u]Madison[/name_u], [name_f]Sophia[/name_f], or [name_f]Isabella[/name_f] is named this here…no kidding

@itsjustjack

most “mainstream” unisex names (Taylor, Cameron, Morgan, Riley, Casey) work better on boys

YES!!!

@itsjustjack

I personally don’t like most nickname names on their own (ie without a full name).

same, for most names

@itsjustjack

calling these names “weird Irish names” is at the very least a little hurtful to families like mine

yes. I agree.

@itsjustjack

Honestly my biggest wish for the Nameberry community is that we could embrace international names more.

Yes!!

@leafsgirl44

I love “cheesy” word names - Sunday, Journey, Miracle, Promise, Hope, Harmony, Heaven, Mercy, Truly, Serenity, Genesis, Heavenly, Sapphire, Harvest, Blessing, Kaydence, Jubilee, Eden, Faith, Charity, Grace, Hosanna, Praise, Liberty, Lyric, Sailor, Delight, etc.

SAME!!

@leafsgirl44

Also, I find “too religious” to be a bit of an uncomfortable phrase sometimes, as I feel as though it means I should be ashamed or embarrassed over the fact that my names are “too religious” and that just doesn’t quite sit right with me

yes. I am not ashamed of having names that are “too religious” cause it’s what I beleive and I feel very strongly about my faith. If people don’t like it, that’s fine! Not everybody is the same religion! [name_m]Just[/name_m] acceptance is all I ask, not everybody has to like the names!

@OpheliaFlora

As for names from different cultures, I say embrace them, embrace your heritage but also expect that people will not spell or pronounce them correctly (perhaps ever).

Yes. [name_f]My[/name_f] name is [name_f]Elena[/name_f]. Not exactly a specific cultural name, it has many different roots, but people literally say “I’m too southern for that” and “I’m not even gonna try” when I say it’s pronounced [name_f]El[/name_f]-eh-nuh. Not that hard people.

@OpheliaFlora

Not so much a hot take but my train of thought, without judgement.

done!

[lateaugust]

How would you feel about a non Irish person using traditional Irish names with traditional spellings (i.e. [name_f]Niamh[/name_f], [name_u]Fiadh[/name_u])? Would you appreciate the spellings being “normalized” or is it inappropriate? (Not naming, just curious)

[ethelmary]

@EJpuddlejumper

yes. I am not ashamed of having names that are “too religious” cause it’s what I beleive and I feel very strongly about my faith. If people don’t like it, that’s fine! Not everybody is the same religion! Just acceptance is all I ask, not everybody has to like the names!

[name_f]My[/name_f] opinions about this is based on “If the child comes out as non-religious in the future, would they feel okay with that name?”, rather than the parent’s beliefs. I respect everyone’s choice, though.

[EJpuddlejumper]

Yes! That is why I don’t usually use specifically religious names I just like them

[leafygreens]

Fredrick [name_f]Rose[/name_f] is beautiful!

[itsjustjack]

I personally wouldn’t feel great about it generally, but honestly it depends on the name. Some Irish names (like [name_f]Ciara[/name_f], [name_f]Orla[/name_f], [name_f]Shauna[/name_f], [name_f]Fiona[/name_f], [name_f]Finola[/name_f]) have been Anglicized and widespread for so long that I don’t think it feels particularly appropriative.

For names where there is a widely accepted Anglicized spelling ([name_f]Neve[/name_f], [name_f]Maeve[/name_f], [name_f]Una[/name_f], [name_f]Erin[/name_f], [name_u]Finn[/name_u]) I am personally of the opinion that if you’re not Irish, using the Anglicized spelling is the way to go. I’m not crazy about some of these spellings (see: my precious comment about [name_f]Neve[/name_f]) but I think in these cases, they make sense and I do understand why Anglicized spellings of them exist / are widespread.

At the same time, I would greatly appreciate the normalization of spellings like [name_f]Niamh[/name_f], [name_f]Fionnuala[/name_f], [name_f]Saoirse[/name_f], [name_f]Aine[/name_f], etc.

Might be more of a complex rant than you’re bargaining for, but I wanted to take the time to give a thoughtful answer to a very thoughtful question. And, YMMV! Other Irish or Irish-descended folk may not feel the same way this is just my personal take which honestly is still developing.

[lateaugust]

Thank you so much! I appreciate you taking the time to think it through